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Ogre-like Translations: Karna ・ CCC, Apocrypha and How That Affects Karna Fanboys

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by
You
, July 3rd, 2014 at 01:07 PM (11403 Views)
Btw, I felt like I should say that everything in my blog is spoilers. Should have said it at the beginning, but it's only now that I realize I should say it. So spoilers, everything. Don't read if you don't want spoilers.

対魔力：C
二節以下の詠唱による魔術を無効化する。
大魔術・儀礼呪法など、大掛かりな魔術は防げない。
ただし宝具である黄金の鎧の効果を受けているときは、この限りではない。
Magic Resistance: C
Magecraft of two bars and under and nullified.
Is unable to protect against High Thaumaturgy and Ritual Class spells, Large scale magecraft.
However, when receiving the effect of the Noble Phantasm Golden Armor Magic Resistance is not limited to this.

So same as CMIV completely.

貧者の見識：A
相手の性格・属性を見抜く眼力。
言葉による弁明、欺瞞に騙されない。
天涯孤独の身から弱きものの生と価値を問う機会に恵まれたカルナが持つ、相手の本質を掴む力を 表す。
Discernment of the Poor: A
Has the observation powers to see through the opponent's personality, alignment.
During verbal communication, will not be fooled by deception.
A person without any relatives and therefore all alone in the world Karna was blessed with the opportunity to question the weak and their worth. He is able to grasp the opponent's true nature.

Same as CMIV again.
Also Christemo, this is not a Karna only skill. As long as you were poor and understood people you will get this skill.

騎乗: A
幻獣・神獣ランクを除くすべての獣、乗り物を自在に操れる。
Riding: A
Other than Phantasmal Beast and Divine Beasts, he can freely ride any other vehicle.

CMIV says "this rank means you have aptitude for the Rider Class." Is cut here. So please never use that again for any Rider qualification discussions. Also his rank from CCC is B. Why? I don't know.

無冠の武芸：－
様々な理由から他に認められることになかった武具の技量。
柤手からは剣、槍、弓、騎乗、神性のランクが実際のものより一段階低く見える。
真名が明らかになると、この効果は消滅。
Uncrowned Martial Arts: -
Arms competency that went unrecognized due to various reasons.
According to the opponent sword, spear, bow, riding, and divinity's ranks all appear one rank lower than they actually are.
After the True Name is revealed the effect disappears.

This is not a Karna only skill.

魔力放出(炎)：A
武器ないし自身の肉体に魔力を帯びさせ、
瞬間的に放出することによって能力を向上させる。
カルナの場合、燃え盛る炎が魔力となって使用武器に宿る。
Prana Burst (Flame): A
Weapons and body are infused with magical energy,
this instantaneous release elevates ability.
In Karna's case burning flames turn into magical energy that infuse the weapon.

Same as CMIV

神性：A
太陽神スーリヤの息子であり、死後にスーリヤと一体化するカルナは、最高の神霊適正を持つ。
この神霊適正は神性がB以下の太陽神系の英霊に対して、高い防御力を発揮する。
Divinity: A
Sun God Surya's son. After death he unified with Surya making Karna one who possesses the highest Divine Spirit aptitude.
This Divine Spirit aptitude is for when fighting Sun God Class Heroic Spirits with Divinity B rank and lower. High defensive power is shown.

So there a plenty of people who when making the servant Arjuna give him the same second line as Karna. No. Please never do that. That is a Karna specific thing. Karna became a god and is basically Surya that's why he gets the defense against people like Cu. Arjuna never did anything like that. If Kintoki's stat sheet is considered canon then maybe.

So I hate Karna. Why? Karna's fine, but his CCC stuff and his Apocrypha stuff are completely out of whack. Example in CCC he doesn't even have Prana Burst (Flame) as a listed skill, what's up with that?
Also like I said before his Riding is A here but only B there and most importantly the stats are different. You'd think his stats would be lower in CCC where his Master is Jinako and Extra Materials points out "Karna is nerfed because of Jinako." But no. He has better stats than he does in Apocrypha where all the Red Servants are plugged into the Greater Grail.
So basically there really is no way to put CCC Karna together with Apocrypha Karna and make them make sense. lolMoon Cell all you like but Cu has the same stats as F/SN Cu which at the same time seems to show that Kotomine did max out Cu's stats, since Extra!Cu has the same stats. Of course there's the problem of where the personal skills like Disengage and Protection from Arrows went but stat-wise they are the same.

Neckbeard problems indeed.
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Comments

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  1. yokushi's Avatar
    It's even funnier because in CCC, he clearly uses Prana Burst when he attacks or guards. But it's not that the stats change that much, it's kinda like Cu Chulainn and his better endurance in Extra. The rest is the same as that A+ in Luck was already explained.

    Also, I don't think that the Red Servants were plugged into the Great Grail since the beginning, only after they snatched it away, right?
    Updated July 3rd, 2014 at 01:30 PM by yokushi
  2. LJ3's Avatar
    Thanks, You. I didn't know that there was a huge discrepancy.

    And I'm puzzled at that Cu had the same stats then. I thought he would have had higher stats under Bazett and certainly Rin.
  3. yokushi's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by LJ3
    Thanks, You. I didn't know that there was a huge discrepancy.

    And I'm puzzled at that Cu had the same stats then. I thought he would have had higher stats under Bazett and certainly Rin.
    Actually, he does not. Extra Cu has A Endurance. It's the same change.
  4. You's Avatar
    Extra Cu's A END is due to Rin messing around with the skills showing you how top tier she is that she can do that. She double rank downed Battle Continuation to C and shoved it in his C rank END to get A rank END. Base stats are still the same.
    Luck for Extra Cu was D but in Extra Materials it's E again.

    Also:
    Quote Originally Posted by deaddrunk View Post
    Ah, that reminds me. The red Servants are being powered by some connection to the Greater Holy Grail that was set up by Red Assassin.
  5. yokushi's Avatar
    Karna's base stats are the same too outside that rank A Endurance (Luck A+ was explained already in the Extra CCC Matrix). Maybe losing his armor gave him more Endurance the same way that downgrading Battle Continuation did it to Cu.

    And yes, I know about the connection to the Greater Grail, but that only comes to play in v4 when the Red Camp already snatched it in v2 so they can mess with it, so this base stats probably don't relate to it.
  6. You's Avatar
    Karna's stats were released in vol 4 with his Master as Shirou. So yeah best to assume that since stats are related to one's magical energy supply these are Karna's maxxed out stats. But they're different from CCC Karna who has a bad Master's stats. That's the problem same with Cu. Everyone expects Cu to have better stats under Bazett but in Extra, under Rin who also has great circuits it's the same as Kotomine.
    I'd agree with the giving armor thing, but it doesn't make sense why not having armor would give him better CON.
  7. yokushi's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by You
    Karna's stats were released in vol 4 with his Master as Shirou. So yeah best to assume that since stats are related to one's magical energy supply these are Karna's maxxed out stats. But they're different from CCC Karna who has a bad Master's stats. That's the problem same with Cu. Everyone expects Cu to have better stats under Bazett but in Extra, under Rin who also has great circuits it's the same as Kotomine.
    I'd agree with the giving armor thing, but it doesn't make sense why not having armor would give him better CON.
    Well, that's entering fanon territory so we just don't know. If they suddenly get even better in the final battle, we could think about it. But I think it will probably be something like Iskandar powerup at the final battle in Zero, ultimately pointless and just for flavor. You can also go and say that as they were released at the beginning of the novel (when that Grail connection thing was still not into play) the stats doesn't reflect that. As I said, pure fanon territory here.

    Also, it's said in Apo v2 that Karna nerfs himself because high prana consumption and Master burden. In CCC he doesn't fight using his spear for example.

    I find funny too how you are going all neckbeard over this and not about how different Extra Vlad and Apo Vlad are.
    Updated July 3rd, 2014 at 02:49 PM by yokushi
  8. You's Avatar
    Sure that's fanon territory, but we know that Karna's stats are that after Shirou Kotomine takes the contract for all the Servants since it has his name in the Master slot, so the stats show Karna when he has Shirou as a Master, Grail buff or no Grail buff. So rather than "we don't know," we know it's either Shirou as Master and no Grail, or Shirou as Master with Grail. One of those is obviously better than Jinako, the other one you could argue.
    As for the self-nerfing, stats show the max possible at such a time so nerfing yourself shouldn't change anything because you still have access to a large amount, you just aren't using it. At least those were food's words not mine. His example was Excalibur changing in Zero.
  9. Lycodrake's Avatar
    Where is Christemo. You'd think he would be all over this.
  10. Mcjon01's Avatar
    Like Karna's loyalty isn't so through the roof that a simple decision not to use his full power for his Master's sake is equivalent to an actual unsurpassable reduction in stats to whatever level he arbitrarily decided to operate at.
    Updated July 3rd, 2014 at 04:10 PM by Mcjon01
  11. Rafflesiac's Avatar
    I like how everything below and including the Divinity section is a different font.
  12. Rafflesiac's Avatar
    Also, is Karna's ability to turn his cape into an awesome set of FLAMING JETPACK WINGS in his stat sheet, or somewhere else?
  13. yokushi's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Rafflesiac
    Also, is Karna's ability to turn his cape into an awesome set of FLAMING JETPACK WINGS in his stat sheet, or somewhere else?
    That's supposed to be Prana Burst, but it's funnier to think is part of the stuff Karna can do just because and it's not listed anywhere. He got the power to surpass logic and stat pages after all.
    Updated July 3rd, 2014 at 05:29 PM by yokushi
  14. Petrikow's Avatar
    Fate/EXTRA stuff is only worth considering in the context of EXTRA.

    The Karna example isn't even close to the first EXTRA inconsistency.
  15. Kotonoha's Avatar
    Well except again CCC Karna is the Nasu Karna.
  16. Petrikow's Avatar
    Nasu can suck it.
  17. Petrikow's Avatar
    Also, fuck You for trying to impose his will through his poor translations.
  18. Kotonoha's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrikow
    Nasu can suck it.
    apocrypha truly is the cancer
  19. Petrikow's Avatar
    I haven't even read F/A but you ain't tricking me into taking the highly divergent alternate universe moon computer simulation premise game seriously.
  20. You's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrikow
    Also, fuck You for trying to impose his will through his poor translations.
    I was thinking about this on my walk back home. Now that I'm back home I found this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrikow View Post
    Divinity: B
    Arjuna is born from the union of Indra, the Vedic God of lightning and storms, and princess Kunti. This particular divine spirit aptitude grants Arjuna high special defensive power against other Heroic Spirits descended from a lightning God’s lineage of Divinity C and lower.

    Any comments and criticism is welcome.


    I care enough about you all to think about you guys during my commute <3 <3.
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